Swirl meets Julie Goddard, The Success Architect. Julie is an award-winning business psychologist and leadership coach who has partnered with our founder, Sarah Abbott MW, to create The Blend. The Blend is a series of virtual workshops designed to increase the representation of women in leadership in the drinks industry. You can find out more about The Blend in our blog, or via their dedicated website. But we also wanted to talk to Julie to give you a flavour of how her business psychologist’s brain and background in education bring a unique flavour to this exciting new initiative.
Tell us about The Blend and why you think that the workshops are important.
The Blend is world class leadership training for women in the wine industry. It’s a collaboration between me, The Success Architect, and Sarah Abbott, and is very exciting for both of us, drawing on Sarah’s highly developed skills and knowledge as an MW and my own skills as an award-winning coach and business psychologist.
To date, there have been a couple of initiatives designed to support women in wine. Things like sponsorship for various wine qualifications and a few surveys. It provides an excellent starting point to understand the different perceptions of the genders within the industry – but we want The Blend to build on these foundations. We will offer women professional development to complement their wine knowledge.
For both Sarah and I it feels increasingly important to do so. Wineries are having to operate in increasingly unpredictable, volatile conditions – from lockdowns to climate challenges. When you consider those factors in the context of studies which highly correlate female leadership with higher morale, increased productivity and retention of talented staff, removing barriers so that more women can take the lead is just good business sense.
I also think it’s something that consumers expect to see more of now. Sarah and I both feel it’s the right place, right time, with the right skillset (between us) so – it’s a no brainer.
But we wanted to be sure that anything we offered didn’t just resonate – that it would have highly practical applications. As far as we know, this is the first instance of women in the drinks trade being offered a practical course which will give them practical skills. Having a skill set which will see you through tough times is incredibly important. And to take others with you – that’s the goal we aspire to.
You’ve identified ‘qualification collection’ as a particularly female trait. Coming from a non-wine background, and with a clutch of your own professional qualifications in your field, what do you make of the wine trade’s emphasis on formal qualifications?
I’ve got two masters degrees; something like seven leadership qualifications; three coaching qualifications. At what point do you pause and think: “what’s driving this need for external validation?” Is it to stay abreast of developments in your industry – because that’s essential? Or is to do with self-validation – because then you should stop and pause. There’s just as much value in practically learnt skills which don’t give you a certificate for your wall.
Having said that – I thought your point about wine industry qualifications was very interesting. There’s a definite place for these sorts of industry-specific qualifications. You can’t become a teacher without your PCG. You need to get your CFA to work in finance. These qualifications also give you a shared lexicon and a shared ground base of experience and a way to relate to things. So, I do think there’s a place and a time for those formal qualifications.
But if that’s all there is it becomes quite closed. There’s a real danger of thinking: “well, this is the way we’ve always done it. This is the way of thinking you need to partake in. This is the language you need to use”. Then it becomes a story of stagnation. And I think disruption is essential for growth.
There’s a tension in the space between the demands and traditions of an established curriculum and the desire to be our own unique selves. That tension – that space between the two – is fertile ground for creativity and I think that’s what we’re seeing with some of the smaller wineries to find their own language, their own way of communicating.
I think both are equally needed. Where one becomes in anyone’s eyes worth more than the other, that’s where we open ourselves to the question of snobbery and elitism. There’s growth, room, creativity enough for everyone to find their own authentic voice in the story of wine.
If you could have every manager in the wine trade do one thing to promote gender and racial diversity what would it be?
Call out bad behaviour when you see it.
Every time you see it.
It’s practical. It’s immediate. It’s low cost. It works.
As a manger you’re key to setting the tone and defining the culture of your work place. So, don’t let it be labelled as ‘banter’, as a joke. Act as if what you do makes a difference. Because it does. As you challenge people, it will change things. When you do this, you begin to create safety for your team. They’ll feel like they have a place where they belong, where their ideas and opinions matter. That simple action of challenging bad behaviour when you see it – has the power to transform the workplace. And it costs nothing other than your awareness that inaction is an action in itself.
I’d also say, managers should remember that to do nothing, to think “that’s not my responsibility”: that keeping quiet is an action.
When we challenge embedded behaviour that’s where grow happens.
One thing we’re particularly interested in at Swirl is the tension between the perceived ‘right’ technocratic way to communicated about wine, and more emotional communication styles. What do you make of this? It chimes with other comments you’ve made about not having to use the typical boardroom language of machismo to succeed as a woman in leadership.
Your emphasis on the perceived ‘right’ way is the most interesting thing to me.
In psychology there’s a saying that two people can be looking at the exact same thing but see something completely different. It’s not logical – it’s psychological. Every action is a perception – so how can we say what is ‘right’? For me, the right way is using your authentic voice. That’s the right way – does it feel authentic to you. Because consumers connect far more strongly with an authentic voice and brand. It’s as much about the story behind the label as it is about the wine itself.
If you are rooted in your own authenticity then negativity will be like water off a duck’s back. Always remember – what you think of me is none of my business.
If the more formal, established language resonates with you then that’s great. Use it. Equally, if it feels uncomfortable or limiting for you then follow your instincts. The world is big enough to accommodate both styles of communication. And there’s a lot of disruptive influences emerging in the wine industry at the moment, especially on social media. I think it’s such a good thing. It’s all about finding your tribe.
Finding the people who get you, who understand you, who want your product and that only happens when you’re being authentic to yourself.
